PeopleUnplugged
A monthly trek through the world of Learning and Development. Helping you not to forget...
PeopleUnplugged
"Meno-ology" - with Aisling Lord
Discover the transformative world of menopause with Aisling Lord, a pioneering menopause consultant at Meno-ology. Aisling's unique journey through surgical menopause sheds light on the glaring gaps in education and support for women navigating this significant life stage. Fueled by her personal experiences, Aisling's mission is to empower women and workplaces with critical knowledge, dismantling misconceptions and advocating for a more menopause-friendly environment. So, whether you're experiencing menopause, approaching it, or wanting to understand what the women in your life are going through, this episode is for you!
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Welcome to People Unplugged, the podcast from the creative team at People Unboxed. Together, we'll explore the cutting-edge technologies that are revolutionizing learning engagement and, most importantly, equip you with actionable tips to transform your learning. I'm Westy, Digital Director at People Unboxed. This is the People Unplugged podcast.
Speaker 2:Digital Director at People Unboxed. This is the People Unplugged podcast.
Speaker 1:Good afternoon everybody. Great to see you again. This month I'm joined by Aisling Lord, menopause consultant at Menology, and if I've butchered that I apologize. She'll give you a chance to put that right in a second. Ash is someone I've known for a while. She's a passionate advocate for menopause awareness and support I think it's fair to say and also dedicated to transforming workplaces into menopause-friendly environments. That's one part of it. The other hat she wears is offering personalized guidance on women navigating menopause, hopefully empowering them to plan for this life stage a little bit proactively. So lovely to see you, ash. How are you getting on?
Speaker 2:Yeah, great Lovely to see you too. We were just having a little chat. It's about three years since I've seen you at a learning exhibition, so thank you for having me on today.
Speaker 1:No, no, no problem at all. So let's start with that. Maybe we can get into how do we get to where we are today, and feel free to cover as much of that as you like, and then we'll get into the meat of the show, if that's all right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely so. As you said, menology, you didn't butcher it, you got it spot on. So the name menology is information and education around menopause. So menol for menopause and ology for the knowledge piece. And why that exists today is because of mainly my own personal journey and my own research and findings.
Speaker 2:As a 45-year-old lady faced with a medical hysterectomy which I would be surgically menopausal after, I very quickly found out that there wasn't any real support out there where I could go to in terms of support group or education, because it wasn't part of my curriculum when I was at school. Sure, we covered reproductive health periods, the bees and the birds, the birds and the bees, the bees and the bees, and and all down that road, but we never actually touched on menopause. So here I am, faced with this dilemma that I'm definitely going to be menopausal because it's a surgical menopause, and I thought where do I go? Where do I turn to? What even is menopause? And when my consultant started talking about hormones, I was completely bamboozled and probably felt a little bit embarrassed as well. But how could I have twins, another child later and not know anything about menopause? I mean, who am I.
Speaker 2:So I decided that that wasn't quite good enough to find myself in that position and it wasn't actually good enough, um, for any female. I decided to do something about it. I'm quite the catalyst, so when I get something between my teeth, I'm like, right, I'm gonna make that happen, I'm gonna, I'm gonna succeed in that, because it's for the greater good and something that you know, many of us will benefit from as well. So I said about taking on extra education. I've always been a life coach, as you know, worked in learning, development and HR. You know I've been hanging about this space for 25 years, but now I specialize in women's health and women's hormones and, in particular, menopause. So I did a menopause expert course and I've also become affiliated with the British Menopause Society, which has been very good in informing me and where I get most of my information from.
Speaker 2:So, as you rightly said, I'm here to plan for not the menopause, but your menopause, because every menopause is different. It's it's not as straightforward as the menopause. There's many, many different symptoms that people will get, people won't get. But also, we are the first generation, and I say we, um, you know us ladies in our 40s, 50s, we're the first professional, uh, working ladies through menopause and this is why we've heard so much about it and we need that help and support when I need to help and support employers as well to make those environments right. So that's kind of the passion where it's come from and why I'm sitting here today in front of you and your audience, to talk about menopause.
Speaker 1:Fantastic If we can break the show down maybe into two parts, just based on what you've said there.
Speaker 1:So maybe we can start with supporting women, because that's obviously a big part of what you do.
Speaker 1:But then I'm also really interested into digging into educating businesses a little bit and also giving them some ideas of where to get what can they do, what can they do to help where can, because then there's a lot of noise going on around menopause at the moment, which is great, but, but a lot of that is this is a really important topic, and then that stops and it's like okay, I get that, but what do I do with that? So, if it's okay with you, we'll sort of like go in those sort of two directions and I know you can wear both of those hats, which would be brilliant. So if we could start with the first one then, which is about supporting women that are, you know, either going through menopause or or, you know, premenopause at the moment is something that's on the horizon. Um, can you take me through some of the biggest misconceptions about menopause, maybe, and how do they influence women's experience of life or work? Because there's a lot of noise. Does that make sense?
Speaker 2:well, I think good place to start is what actually is menopause? Great? Um, because, as I said, sat in that consultation. I didn't want to ask because I felt, as a female, it's my right place to know. But, as I said, it wasn't included in the curriculum when we were doing physical health at school.
Speaker 2:So the menopause comes in three different stages really is the best way to think about it. It is in a hormonal imbalance, so our brain is a hormonal fed machine. So when we talk about women's hormones, we talk about estrogen, we talk about oestrogen and we talk about progesterone. We also talk about testosterone sometimes as well, which is the male sex hormone, which is contributed to things like libido and things like that, and we do sometimes have that replacement therapy as well.
Speaker 2:But when we start menopause, that is when we see a decline of oestrogen, and oestrogen is really important and we have oestrogen receptors throughout our bodies. So in our brain it regulates our temperature, it regulates our heartbeat, it regulates our protective layer in our skin, it regulates our liver, our kidneys, our urine and how often and frequently we go to toilet and things like that. So oestrogen sends all the little single signals to the brain as to what our body is going to do next and, understandably, when we have a decline in that, the signals go down and the signals drop off. So we start to experience a number of symptoms that will affect us, and these happen at various different times for different people. So when we are born, we're thought to have anywhere between 1 million and 2 million eggs in our body, and when they start to decline is through ovulation. So menstruation and we'll be ovulate. Before that, we lost our eggs through ovulation and that's the start of menopause, which ironically and please don't be scared anyone starts when we're 20.
Speaker 2:But we don't recognize it because we have millions of eggs, like I said, so it's hey, it's no problem.
Speaker 1:Right, the clock's ticking. From that point is pretty much what you're saying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the clock is ticking. But we have millions of eggs, so we're well catered for. But it just depends how quickly they deplete. And how quickly they deplete is when we hit something called perimenopause, which is the stage before menopause. So we will have all the usual regular periods, mental cycles, but we kind of notice some changes. Where we're a bit more moody, where our breasts are a bit more tender, our periods could be all sorts of light and heavier on unwelcome, turn up whatever they want, kind of thing. And then we get lots of other symptoms and just to bring it to life, I'm going to mention a few. We might get heart palpitations, we might get anxiety, imposter syndrome, we might have sleepless nights, we might have itchy skin, we might find it really difficult to process some foods and alcohols and things. We might get really itchy skin. Um, we'll have all sorts of symptoms. If I said to you sorry, can, I can I can.
Speaker 1:I just this is, and I you knew that I'd be absolutely fascinated, so let's pick up on what you just said there. So when you said a range of symptoms and this is where the miseducation comes in, or the misunderstanding, or whatever you want to call that it's what people have hot flushes, right, and that's it. Two of the things you've just described, there are more mental things than they are physical things. You said, like, about anxiety, and so I just wanted to call that out because it's not just physical things.
Speaker 2:Then right, no, no, exactly. So psychologically, during menopause, as I said, the brain is a hormone run machine and when you have an imbalance in anything you know think about driving your car down the road and you have an imbalance of air pressure in the in the rear back tire, then how's your car going to be driving? It's going to be a bit wonky.
Speaker 1:It's going to be a bit off, it's not going to place, it's not hard to control, dare I say yeah, yeah, hard to control.
Speaker 2:Um, not that I'm saying a perimenopause, you know are hard to control, but we find it hard to control because one of those or many of those estrogen receptors are not getting enough estrogen. Just like our car isn't getting enough air pressure in that tire, we're not getting enough estrogen. So we become imbalanced. We become hormonally imbalanced and that's when we start to get the hot flashes or the hot flushes, the, the anxiety, the imposter syndrome, the itchy skin, um, the really sore joints, the dry eye, lots of different things, um, and that's kind of a nice layman's term introduction into how that imbalance actually affects the body. And that's where we get the term menology, because it's um, um, menopause is a period of time. It's a period of time and that's a good thing to come on to. Next is how long does perimenopausal last for? Yeah, right, so we realize more and more every day it seems to be earlier, but the NHS say 40 to 45 is early onset perimenopause, but we are recognizing it as young as women, as 35.
Speaker 1:but we are recognizing it. As young as women is 35, and why is that getting? Is that just it's not to do with awareness, or is it actually?
Speaker 2:getting earlier, we believe, and there's not enough research to do um with the, the study of um. Endocrine disruptors. Now, what I mean by endocrine disruptors are things that are around in our environment. We live a very lavish life these days compared to, you know, women going back to the early 1900s. What I mean by lavish lifestyle is we have beautiful scented homes, we have really strong cleaners with chemicals in it, we put a lot of chemicals on our skin, in our hair, we wash our clothes with with chemicals, very fragrant things, and we also have a lavish sort of lifestyle socially where we eat lots of different foods, we drink lots of different alcohols and we all have to take account for the effect that's going to have on our hormones, is actually going to diminish them and depress them somewhat, and our skin is a huge receptor for all of these.
Speaker 2:So things like you know, wearing gloves, buying more, maybe naturally scented candles with, you know, natural oils, or maybe using natural oils and a bit of cotinol in the back of our radiator rather than having something chemical burn through our home. So these are all things that I've picked up on, that I've been doing and I'm thinking, gosh, why do I feel so this and why do I feel so? That? And then, when I look into it and my research and my study shows that things like this actually depress our hormones even more so. So that's why we see earlier and earlier onset perimenopausal symptoms within our females, and I think it's really important. Can we stop perimenopausal symptoms? No, but we can delay them. So by educating today our daughters and younger females within our family maybe to use less of or make better choices, organic choices then we can delay those perimenopausal symptoms and we can actually lighten them a little bit as well so is that?
Speaker 1:that's one of the ways women perhaps can be slightly more proactive things we We've said realistically. I'm going to tell a terrible story, but just summarising what you've said then. So almost from 20 onwards, this clock's ticking right and we found out about it now, a little bit too late for some of us. But let's learn from those and let's see what we can do about it going forward. And I've got two daughters, one's 17, one's 19. I would love them to. I'm sure they will listen back. So, yes, that's someone. So people can effectively prepare both physically and mentally, is that?
Speaker 2:fair to say. So you've given me some examples of that.
Speaker 1:But what else can they do?
Speaker 2:so big thing as well is.
Speaker 1:By the way, this is person. This is really for my own personal benefit. So I've got my. My wife was 50 this year and I said I've got two daughters. So, trust me, this is a very female heavy house.
Speaker 2:So I I love the opportunity to ask all those questions that people just wouldn't ask, so I I really appreciate it no, and I think it's fantastic because, as I said, my passion is awareness and spreading awareness and making it okay to talk about these things. Um, you know, everybody born with all freeze will go through the menopause. Um, it's not optional, we will go through it. So we really need to have an awareness and an education. Things that um will help us plan for a menopause is education knowing what's coming, knowing how to prepare for it, knowing what to expect. That's the big thing. The next thing is nutritional guidance as well knowing what you're eating, knowing what you're putting into your body.
Speaker 2:So there's a thing called phytoestrogens, which mimic the estrogen in our body and that's found in lots of foods that we can eat. Lots of nice winter squashes around this time of year, so including them in your diets. Lots of leafy greens, lots of berries, pomegranates, things like that. Also, lots of legumes and pulses have loads of phytoestrogens in them and it really is eating from the garden. So things like whole foods are best for prolonging and getting through perimenopausal and menopausal symptoms, so really boosting our body with those phytoestrogens. Anything that comes in a box or a bag isn't whole food. It's wrapped up in a chemical itself, because the plastic is chemical, probably produced some kind of petroleum, and all those things are going to have an effect on the food that's in there and then the food that we actually put into our body. So that's one of the things.
Speaker 2:And then the last thing is really physical movement. We are living for longer. You know we're around a lot longer. We want to be able to take those flights of stairs, we want to be able to carry our shopping, we want to be able to be self-helping as we move into our higher tens in our life, our 70s and 80s, because we will be around much longer now. So we want to be able to maintain muscle because with oestrogen and the receptors in our body, we have them in our muscles, so they deplete, they decline and then we become weak. And you know how many times has your wife asked you to open a jar of pickles or a jar of jam in the kitchen?
Speaker 1:Occasionally. Occasionally, but to be fair, when I do, she'll probably say that she loosened it first.
Speaker 2:Well, there's always that argument in this house as well. But that is a sign that our muscle is dissipating. So we need to keep the movement up, because muscle memory is key. So I'm not saying enter a weight building competition or anything like that.
Speaker 1:We're not doing marathons this week. We're not doing marathons?
Speaker 2:Yeah, just keep active, keep moving, lots of physical exercise and weight training as well, to a degree as I say, nothing too heavy. Just keep those muscles flexible, moving, warm and keep them there.
Speaker 1:More importantly, and actually, if people are already going through the menopause, is that, is that too late, or will the changes you're suggesting there help them their symptoms as well?
Speaker 2:it's never too late. So to go back, because we were talking about perimenopausal and the common misconception with perimenopausal is oh, I'm through that now. You know, I'm sure I've been perimenopausal for two years and it's like try adding another 18 years. So perimenopausal can last for decades, not just years. So when we go through our perimenopausal transition, how we will know that we are now menopausal is we will stop having menstrual cycles for 12 months, and when we don't have our menstrual cycle for 12 months, we're menopausal, and then we are postmenopausal to the day we leave this earth.
Speaker 2:Now oestrogen doesn't come back. It doesn't magically come back. So we either need to continue with the phytoreastogens through our diets or we need to have a hormone replacement therapy as well. There are lots of herbal remedies that we can have to balance the symptoms that we have. Things like we may have heard of black kosh, which is a herbal remedy. We might have heard of St John's wort for our mind and our mood and uplifting. We might have heard of evening primrose for those aches and joints that we get particularly sore, breast tissue and things like that it can help with. We've heard of magnesium these are all the buzzwords Ashwagandha, lion's mane they all help. Okay, they all help, but in terms of oestrogen, it's going to be diet-led or it's going to be hormone replacement therapy.
Speaker 1:And what's the, if you can touch on this, what's the latest research findings or emerging treatments? Is this just one of those things? Or do you see, you know on the horizon, are treatments getting better? Is there more research being done into this stuff? Everything you've talked about so far really has been, you know, our self-managing and you know thinking about what we eat, and so where's that going? What's the research? There must be research into this, because it's not a problem that's going away, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, all the time, all the time. So you know, years and years ago, paul, hrt and oestrogen was derived from a pregnant mare's urine, so a horse's urine. We take the oestrogen from that, wash it, clean it and put it into a form of HRT, which is very lab-based and very chemically-based. Today we have something called bioidentical hormone replacement theory, which is derived from plants, such as all the plants that I've been mentioning that mimic oestrogen in our body. So that shows how far it's it's come, really, and that's in the uk and that is definitely a huge and significant improvement because back nearly 20, 30 years ago there was a huge white paper produced on the effects of hrt and how it can actually enhance some cancers. Of course it will, um, you know, if you have an oestrogen um lead cancer in your family in terms of your mother's or your auntie's and that was my own reason for having my hysterectomy was my mother has ovarian cancer, which is an oestrogen fed cancer, and adding more risk.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, so um, thankfully, I, I um found that out.
Speaker 2:I'm aware and I know but, all the health care professionals are aware of these and they do add up the risks and make sure that if you are at um risk of estrogen-fired cancers, then you won't be able to take some estrogen um, because estrogen comes in many different formats, and I think that was one of the challenges I had as well. I was like, well, what is hrt? So yeah, you know um you'll have. You have patches um that you could apply to your skin. You have gels that you can apply to your skin. You have tablets that you can apply um. There's some um birth control methods as well that double as part of your hormone replacement therapy. So things like the marina coil that some of your listeners will have heard of before is a progesterone release. So some women have progesterone and oestrogen as hormone replacement therapy, and people who have hysterectomies might only have oestrogen hormone replacement therapy, and people um who have hysterectomies might only have oestrogen hormone replacement therapy. It can be quite complicated, um, but this is why that's why we're here.
Speaker 1:It's an absolute minefield, which, which is great to hear, I mean, if I can pick up on that. So who? Who decides whether a gel or a patch? Or is that down to each individual, like women saying which, what she would prefer and what she finds easier? Or are there medical reasons for each one?
Speaker 2:Oh, definitely, there's a huge part of remembering, because we all have brain fog to a degree when we're perimenopausal, menopausal, I must admit, sometimes I do use it as a little bit of a oh god, brain fog. I forgot.
Speaker 1:Do you know, actually, do you know? I one of my questions. I if sorry I've massively interrupted you, but whilst it's fresh in my mind because I'll forget um, I was delivering a course yesterday, um, and part of it was okay and you can send that back and I I'm not going to mention any names, I'm protecting, protecting the, uh, the guilty, shall I say. And two people went oh, menopause, I'm not good at this stuff and it almost it was a, really straight. It was the first time I'd heard it used as an, I'd say as an excuse. But it wasn't an excuse, it was a. Do you know what? I obviously knew this conversation was coming up and it made me think that in itself, slightly I didn't know where to go with it. So, you know, but you've just said it yourself we use that oh, that's the brain, focus, menopause. That's just the way it is.
Speaker 1:And it was really interesting to see people actually use it as an excuse for why they couldn't do something. And really what we were asking them to do was write some things up on a flip chart, and if that was, we'll come to how business can support things in a minute. But I almost become a bit of a and it was said tongue-in-cheek, but I don't know. We'll save that maybe for in a minute, because when we talk about business support we still need people to be able to do the job right. But it just felt a bit it was it was a difficult one. Sorry, I don't know where I was going with that, but I just as you said.
Speaker 2:I would like to pick something out from that. Firstly, I would like to say congratulations to all of you in the room because you made that okay for those females to say. You created that environment where they could say, oh, I'm menopausal. Um, it might not be that their brain fog is getting in the way, but it might be the anxiety. If I have to stand up and write on that board, I might totally forget what you said or I've got imposter syndrome.
Speaker 2:Listen, I'm no good at this kind of stuff anymore, because we really do focus on the brain fog a lot during menopause, but it's induced by lack of sleep, interrupted sleep, because the lack of oestrogen in our body. And I did mention magnesium earlier on. That is a very good supplement, but a spray is better than a tablet because we can't actually absorb magnesium into the body. But if we do have a spray and we spray it on back of our knees before we go to sleep, we'll have a good sleep and then that actually does improve our performance the following day if we have a good night's sleep.
Speaker 1:Ash, there's something you've just said there and there's like light bulbs going on my head all the time. But there's something you just said there which is I'm not any good at this anymore which which it and again just playing back what was said. It was bizarre. We should have been there because someone said, oh no, you've always been good at this stuff. Now we don't know what's changed in in her world. You know, we don't know, and and you're right.
Speaker 1:So, firstly, it's a very psychologically safe environment, which was lovely that they all had this conversation, but it's interesting that you've said any more. So obviously people are changing, so things are going to change. So maybe we should change gear a little bit now and think about exactly how. How do I support that as a bit, as someone who's running business and I've got people in my team or or in this case there was what? 16 17 people in the room and all varying ages, so some of them just sort of did that nervous and didn't know what, where to go with it, didn't know what to say, which is fine um, so how?
Speaker 1:what advice can we give business leaders or people that are listening to this to think? But I really want to create a safe environment for menopause to be, I say, normalized and discussed openly, and I don't mean discussed as in right let's have a 20 minute discussion about this but for it to be something that we're not shying away from.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, and I think a good place to start is menopause is not a disability. And I think a good place to start is menopause is not a disability and I know we were trying to get that passed as an act and we didn't quite make it. But if we look at the term disability, it's a long-term physical or mental condition that affects you for as long as maybe months or years, and menopausal and perimenopausal symptoms do last for decades, as we discussed earlier. So we do have to bear in mind that some of the symptoms of perimenopausal and menopausal can affect our colleagues in our workplace ongoingly. And remember that no two menopausals are the same. So you know, somebody might have.
Speaker 2:There's some statistics to say that 20% of women I hate to say this, but we have an all right journey, okay, we probably. Sometimes we don't notice too much until our period stop and we go oh, that's interesting, and then we realize that's a beautiful place to be, but that's only 20%. Then we have 20% of females that have horrendous time where they have every symptom recognized by the British Menopause Society. Not only do they have those symptoms, they have them on a severity scale of 10 out of 10 most days, which is so debilitating and very difficult to manage as well you know. Will supplements make a difference? Will phytorectin just make a difference? We don't know. The imbalance is so uncouth that it's really, really difficult. And then we have the remainder. Do you know that? 60%?
Speaker 1:I was doing it in my head.
Speaker 2:Manageable. Manageable symptoms, manageable through education, knowledge, workplace supportiveness, things like that diet, physical exercise. So that's kind of a typical if there is such a thing breakup of the various levels of impact that we're dealing with in the workplace.
Speaker 1:So we're not talking about a one-size-fits-all at all, are we? So when I say what do I need to do when dealing with in the workplace? So we're not talking about a one-size-fits-all at all, so it is.
Speaker 2:When I say, what do I need to do when it's it, I guess the answer to that is it depends, right, but anyway and I think it's really important that we bear that in mind as employers, that it's not the same for jill as it was for jane. Okay, it can be very different and people quite often use that example. Well, I, I'm menopausal and I don't feel like that. She's making it up and it's like not quite, because it's not your menopause, it's her menopause. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, we need to prepare for different people a little bit differently. Where we should start is breaking the taboo down. Make it a conversation. So a coffee menopause chat's a good place to start. Making sure that people know that you're prepared to recognise it within your workplace. The other ways of recognising it is making sure you've got a HR policy in place that supports menopausal women in the workplace.
Speaker 2:Another way is a bit more difficult to do, but not so much when we were pushed into it during COVID prematurely is the flexible working. I am up with the lark. My golden hours, my most productive 5am, 6am, 7am my goodness, my workload is just slashed. After that things take a bitm. 6 am 7 am my goodness, my workload is just slashed. After that things take a bit of a dive. So if you have an environment where you work and employ people that can allow people to come in who are perimenopausal, who've had real struggle sleeping or were up really early and probably going to be going to bed or falling asleep on the sofa at 5 pm, if you can let them work earlier, then this is a good time thing to do, because they're going to be more productive, they're going to be more focused and they're going to get things done, they're going to feel much better. And also the flexible working and working from home.
Speaker 2:Imagine someone has, you know, those symptoms that that 20% of ladies who are really struggling. You know they've got heavy periods, they've got migraines, they've got itchy skin, they've got itchy skin, they've got acne, they've got joint pain, they've got back pain, um, you know they've got urinary tract um repetitive infections that are happening, happening, happening. They're probably not going to feel too comfortable being in a workplace, in a meeting where they have to, you know, run to the loo every 10, 20 minutes. Or you know they, um are in so much pain that they're taking painkillers to relieve them? Um from that joint and muscular pain that they get. Or they're having brain fog where they constantly want to look at notes. Let them look at notes. I've got notes in front of me today because I know I might forget and I don't want to have a moment where I forget on a podcast what I'm actually talking about and we forget things really simple.
Speaker 2:Like you know, we've just said hello Westy, hello Ashley and two minutes time. If your name wasn't there, I go gosh. What's his name? Again, I've just said it now.
Speaker 1:I've confused you could you call me Paul earlier? No, no, it's very right go by either. I'm just trying to confuse things it can be a second.
Speaker 2:You know, you could ask me what last year's budget was and I'll tell you and then you'll ask me again and I'll go. I have no idea. Yeah, I have. No, I have no idea. Um so, things like having notes is really supportive it's fascinating stuff.
Speaker 1:So how, how do I you? You said you have to have an hr policy in place. Um, or you should have an hr policy in place. I mean, yeah, so what does that actually look like then? Is that right, let me? Let me take a step back, because I love the fact you said it's not a disability, because if someone has a physical disability, we, we make reasonable adjustments and there's a. We do that as businesses, we do that, but I guess the onus is on. I'd like to think, anyway, only sort of me as a business to put again reasonable adjustments in place that are supporting those women. Is that what you're seeing in businesses? Or are we seeing it where, well, if they speak up, then we'll do this. So it should be the other way around. Right, the support should be there before you have to put your hand up and say I need help with this. Is that what you're actually seeing?
Speaker 2:so I'm seeing the latter where, um, people are saying, if they come to us to speak to us, um, that we then do something about it. But we want to. We want to change that. So in a recent survey, 40 of employers in the uk do have, um, a menopause policy in place. Um, and that tends to be your bigger employers on, you know. Just to put into um a bit of reality, I said to someone the other day that I used to work with years ago oh, this is what? Because they were like, oh, how are you? And I was like this is what I do now. And I said, oh, um, if you ever need help in your workplace, let me know. And he went ah, doesn't apply to us. We only have three women. Oh, ouch, and I was like but you have three women, you have three women.
Speaker 2:Yes, you have ovaries, who will, will definitely be, and even more so being the minority in a workplace, and perhaps people not understanding who don't have ovaries. What you're going through, um, is uh, kind of a a bit of a it's a no, no brainer, like you're not going to want to work there, you're not going to want to stay there, you're not going to want to say anything, so let's pick up on that.
Speaker 1:so what are the potential consequences, do you think, for businesses who, they will say, fail to prepare and offer support? What does that look like? Obviously, I'm assuming attracting the right talent for a start and the culture, but I'll let you pick that up. So what are the consequences for those people to turn in a blind eye to this stuff?
Speaker 2:There's kind of two sides really One is attraction and one is retention. So when we look at attraction to our business as an employee, an employer sorry we want to attract the right talent and, as I said, we are the first generation of professional women who are, you know, building our skills, building our experiences. We see lots of women on boards. In our experiences. We see lots of women on boards. We see lots of executive women, um, taking, um, you know, big responsibilities and accountabilities within the workplace, and they're there because they have that experience, the qualification and the criteria to be there, and it's a huge loss not to have them there, um.
Speaker 2:So things like, um, the symptoms that we covered already, the imposter syndrome, you know, the low mood, the sleepless nights, can really put women off coming to work.
Speaker 2:And a survey in the NHS recently 10% of women considered giving up their jobs because they found that there wasn't enough support in the workplace. Because they found that there wasn't enough support in the workplace. Between six to eight sorry, a huge proportion of them took six to eight weeks off sick, which is classed as long-term sick in the workplace because the employer wasn't actually supportive. So what we need to look at is retaining the females in our business who are professional and who have got the experience, have got the criteria to take on more responsibility, to take on more accountability in the workplace and appreciate what they're going through. So things like including in your policy who you actually work with, whether it's mental health first aiders, whether it's employee assistant programs, whether it's people like me, menology, providing training if you've produced any business um menopause champions in your business who can signpost very akin to mental health first aid, very akin to that, and also thinking about your environment.
Speaker 2:If your employees wear a uniform, what's it made of? We talked about these endocrine um disruptors. Is it phycos? Is it polyester? Is it cotton? Can I breathe? Do I definitely, definitely have to wear it? Every time I wear it, I feel like I'm in a furnace. My skin's itching. You know I'm ready to go on fire. Is this fair um to ask me to do this? How is it?
Speaker 1:you know, as you're saying, that I've just said that again, I can only apologize because, as you said, that that's blooming obvious. Now, you've laid that out. That's obvious, right. Because we're saying it's your skin. We've got temperature control. What's our uniform made out of? What's the environment like? Have we got the? That's simple stuff, you'd argue. You would argue Right, but you just that's never been on my radar, I wouldn't even consider it and that that, and I'll put my hand up and say that's my lack of understanding, lack of training, lack of awareness, I guess, which comes back to what you're saying is let's just get people talking about it, let's raise some of this awareness. So that's such an easy win I find it frustrating.
Speaker 2:I'm kicking myself because it feels like such an easy win, but it can make a big difference to so many people and I was speaking to some women in the emergency services and they were explaining to me that the emergency services uniforms are just non-binary, they're not for males or not from females. So I've got a few more bumps than men and I want to be comfortable, but it's just so uncomfortable and when they're out on emergency calls and stuff and they have on, you know, unplanned visitors such as their period or a swear or you know they just they can't have that in their workplace, they can't have that. So how do they prepare for that? But they have been sharing with me some great initiatives that have been brought in to their sector to make things like menopause much more manageable. But then into the environment I think that's where I was, was going was you know, one minute I'm really hot, next minute I'm really cold. There's no pleasing us really um, rather hot or cold, but it's just about. It's not about making the whole entire office really hot or the whole entire office really cool, it's about having a room. So things like, lots of people are having menopausal rooms where it's a cool room or a hot room and they can reach a really um, happy temperature for them, they can dip in and out.
Speaker 2:Obviously the wise thing to do is to wear layers, um, so you know, if you do have a uniform, make sure you can layer it up or layer it down appropriately. Fresh drinking water fresh drinking water, not lukewarm water from a tap. Um, it needs to be appealing. We want to enjoy it. We need to drink about two liters a day, um, as a perimenopause or a menopausal women, um, and also, if you have like a canteen or anything, let's go back to the whole food conversation. Let's go back to the conversation and have all your um, you know, nice, fresh food in there and for everybody, for for everybody, not just perimenopausal women um, make it as nutritional as we possibly can, because what we put into our bodies is what we get out. And make it as nutritional as we possibly can, because what we put into our bodies is what we get out. And if we're feeling great, we're going to do great things that work and our customers are going to be happy.
Speaker 2:So it's a full circle and I'm sure I've left loads of really important bits out. I'm sure I have um, but it's enough maybe to feed people's creativity side and imaginations. And, um, and make sure you really get your policy looked over by CIPD. There's lots of good points on there and tips by someone like me. I've seen a few that said menopause affects people between, you know, 50 and 60. Steer away from that. You know 50 and 60, steer away from that. We now know that it's and also sadly um lots of women have, you know, illness like addison's disease or cancers or treatment that will actually bring that menopause physically forward as well. So can we actually put an age in our um policy?
Speaker 1:in our policy.
Speaker 2:No got to be very careful, very careful, um, followed by a, you know it's, it's typical that we could see, but then we have to be mindful that it could be absolutely anybody, because, um, I hate to use the phrase but menopause is ovary failure, um, it's what it falls into.
Speaker 1:So anyone with, you know, pcso or any kind of ovary um illness can can suffer as well, just the same way as a perimenopausal women would suffer ash, I'm looking at the time I think I'm we could recall this for two hours and I, because I have so many other people, might want to listen to it, but you know what I'm learning so much? That's brilliant. Um, I I, if you've listened to the poppy file, I always like to end on well, two things. So we're going to let you know, we're going to let people know in a minute where they can contact you for more support, if they want that support, and and how your, how your business, can help. Before we do that, let's uh, a bit of a personal question for you what, what's your, uh, what's the ideal weekend look like for you? For you, what, what's your, uh, what's the?
Speaker 2:ideal weekend look like for you ideal weekend. You're on the spot there, oh, yeah, no, no, ideal weekend is lazy breakfast on a saturday, um, after I've been for my run, of course. Okay, because I probably should mention that menopause is not the end, it's the beginning. And in every other country, apart from eastern countries, in eastern countries, it's the end of all endings. It's like no, it's not, it's the beginning. Let me tell you why it's the beginning. I shared with you.
Speaker 2:I was faced with this, you know, um consequences of going into surgical menopause. I was so worried, I was tear, I was upset, understandably, went through this direct to me. But before that, I got myself in shape. I started exercising, I started running, I started swimming, I became the best version of myself and only recently I have competed in my first triathlon. So it is not the end, it is beginning.
Speaker 2:I'm absolutely loving life and I crave exercise. I mean, I don't even recognize myself. That's how good it is. Um, so if anyone's out there is thinking that's me, you know, I feel exactly the same. We can turn it around, we really can. There's lots and lots of positives. Education is, is is just so underestimated when it comes to menopause. So, yeah, take inspiration from me. I was so lazy, I was sitting on the sofa. I didn't really want to move because I was perimenopausal before um, and then I educated myself and I came out of it on the other side and I'm just loving life.
Speaker 2:So I have to go for a run, paul, on saturday morning. That's great because I get a little bit of a nosy, but I also do that. What can I see, what can I hear, what can I smell, what's going on, and take life in and the real appreciation piece as well, which is really nice. And then I come back and I wake up all the kids and we have a really lazy breakfast, which is, of course, healthy.
Speaker 2:It used to be bacon, sandwiches and sausages, but I don't do that anymore. I'm all about my Greek yogurt and my fruit and I feel so good. I just it's brilliant. And and then we kind of do a little bit of shopping and then, lovely, wholesome dinner movie, we have treats. I mean we can't live like a monk all the time, can we? So I might have a couple glasses of bicycle big bucket of popcorn. And then Sunday is um getting up and getting all the time, can we? So I might have a couple of glasses of peseco, big bucket of popcorn, and then sunday is um getting up and getting all the jobs done ready for monday.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that's good to me. I, I love it and I, I can, I can hear it and I can see it and I know everyone else can. Your passion about making that difference is is really infectious. So thanks again. So much for your time I really really appreciate it and for accommodating my ridiculous questions and my ignorance. I appreciate that, actually, people want to, and why wouldn't they? So, if people do want to contact you, learn more about what you do, where's the best way to do that?
Speaker 2:So I think most people are going to be watching this on LinkedIn. So my LinkedIn is just Aisling Lord and, linked to my website, is on there. So my website is Meno M-E-N-O hyphen ology, o-l-o-g-y dot com, so you'll find me there. I do lots of free consultations and things, so feel free to reach out. So so, yeah, you can reach me there or there. I also have a facebook page as well.
Speaker 2:Um, so it's just um menology and I give out lots of top tips. Um, I'll look forward to seeing you there and um, no, thank you. Thank you for being so inquisitive, thank you for being so supportive and um, my husband was the one that actually um led me to believe that I was perimenopausal and, um, I can't thank him enough. He was so supportive and he read lots of books. There are lots of books. I won't mention any book. I feel a bridget jones moment coming on, so I won't mention any particular book. Um, but I do think you know, if you are a partner, if you are a dad, if you are a husband, if you are a wife of someone that's going through menopause, do your research and it can make such a difference to her if you're supportive in any way, small ways, big ways, um it, it all helps. It really really does. So congratulations to you. Your daughters and your wife is very lucky to have you be so interested in the topic.
Speaker 1:No worries, what a lovely place to end. And now you've pushed it all back on me. Right, there you go. So, I need to go and find some books. I'll see you on the other side.
Speaker 1:Thanks, for joining us today Feeling curious to learn more about how we help people remember stuff? Or why not sign up for a free trial of our ai powered bite-sized learning app, bento bot? You can do that easily at bentobotcom and you can catch up on interviews with all of our previous guests by subscribing to this pod via apple podcast or any podcast platform. Until next time, take care.
